Follow

πŸ‡¬πŸ‡§ We no longer federate with counter.social.

This means it is now impossible to see statuses, to follow and to interact in any way with people on this instance.

counter.social blocks whole countries they considerate hostile and we believe this is a huge error. This is pure racism, tainted with hate and we don't want to promote this behavior.

counter.social is the only blocked instance on xyz. While we want to be as open as possible to all opinions, we don't want to be open to fascists.

Β· Β· Web Β· 0 Β· 47 Β· 62

@paulfree14 @status thanks! I was unpleasantly surprised that so many proxies are banned here now...

searx.me, wayback maschine, webpage ban 

@status @charlag
...also it can help you to get very simple across any other website ban through directy having a link within the search results to the wayback maschine. (only works for webpages that are stored there)
You just need to klick on 'cached' in the search results, and that's it.

searx.me, wayback maschine, webpage ban 

@paulfree14 yeah, double proxy, what else is left

searx.me, wayback maschine, webpage ban 

@charlag
well they could block searx.me

Then you go to one of the other searx.me plattforms:
github.com/asciimoo/searx/wiki

there are also onion adresses.

@status
thank you. :)
they block nations we block nationalists
✊ ❀

But, and I think that's very important to mention, they don't seem to be fascists.

I have seen jester also speaking out against the muslim ban and also made actions against homophobia.

I think it's important to make the destiction between fascism and nationalism, otherwise me might loose credibility by those how critisice our action.

I agree with all the rest you've said

@paulfree14 @status they're jingoist liberals. jester was in the military. they support the american state unapologetically.

that's functionally the same as fascism because america is built on a fascist mythos. "manifest destiny", "monroe doctrine", "world policeman", etc. are all fascist.

@status so because they block the wrong outgroup...your group is going to block them. #hypocrisy

@status @jeffcliff
why is it hypocricy?

It's simple. I don't want nationalists. What is hypocracy about that?

@paulfree14 @status Then don't claim that it's about who they block. It's much more consistent to not care about who they block, and just block them because they are in your outgroup.

talk, counter.social 

@status @jeffcliff
Are you suggesting that I should change the reasons of my decision to want them blocked?
Why shouldn't I claim the reason for my desicion, but adopt to your suggestions?

Am I just confused or are you tryn to be manipulative.
If you don't umderstand my reasons ask.
If you don't understand my arguments describing the reasons ask.

If you want to chat about rethoric and biases insteat, we can also do that. 😜

talk, counter.social 

@paulfree14 @status you do whatever you want. But if you are going to use both reasons, that is hypocritical. If you choose the latter reason, it is not hypocritical. It's not really a bias thing.

talk, counter.social 

@status @jeffcliff
will you explain why one reason is hypocritical and the other isn't?

talk, counter.social 

@paulfree14 @status the other reason is you block group #G_002 is due to some property of #G_002 that you do not presumably necessarily exhibit. But if you block #G_002 because they block #G_003, you're blocking them because of blocking. Your reason of your blocking is something in that case you *do* necessarily exhibit.

@jeffcliff @status good job u made an equivalency good thing those are never false

@dn3s @status How is it false? If you substitute #G_001 for group 1 and #G_002 for group 2 #G_003 for group 3, who is blocking who and why? #G_001 is blocking #G_003 #G_002 is blocking #G_001 for blocking #G_003.

@status
if you wonder who else is promoting counter . social

''In 2003, Cuban founded the Fallen Patriot Fund to help families of U.S. military personnel killed or injured during the Iraq War.'' His networth is
US$3.3 billion (March 2017)

@paulfree14 @status portugal the man, seriously? i'm so disappointed in them...

@status

yeah, that seems like a great reason to ban an instance.

@status

in case anyone didn't know, i am being sarcastic here.

a misinformed blocking policy, largely implemented through cloudflare, while unfortunate, is not really a good reason to block an instance, nor imply that they are fascists.

remember when you block instances, you are punishing *users* not the *owner*

@status

i mean, if you want to ban counter.social, be honest about the real reason: wanting to ban jester and his social circle, because you don't like them.

because really his bad take on anti-abuse policies is not causing your instance any abuse.

and no, i am not *personally* a fan of the guy, but that's no reason to ban his instance.

no to nationalism 

@status @kaniini

I can just describe it from my perspective.
I'm since yesterday calling to kick them out.
I had little knowledge about jester. Someone on twitter mentiond counter .social while I talked about mastodon. So I checked it out.

My desicion to want to get them kicked, was only based on viewing the webpage.
...then I made some more search on jester...and wanted it even more.

But that's not what my decision is based on.

no to nationalism 

@paulfree14 @status @kaniini

Paul... look at the timeline of kaniini ...
Dont wonder why he defends him ^^

no to nationalism 

@baerlinbaer @paulfree14 @status

by the way, i'm not defending jester, i am advocating for being transparent in blocking him instead of using his about page.

THERE ARE SO MANY BETTER REASONS.

nationalism, counter social 

@status @kaniini

no. They choosed to join an instance deep grounded in nationalism.

THEY block many other users and instances, just for the reson they are somewhere which is defined by jester as a 'hostile nation'

They block 'nations' we block nationalists.

Simple. What's the issue?

nationalism, counter social 

@status @kaniini

I agree that the usage of the word fascist is a bit missleading (or I miss some informations).
But it's full blast nationalism.

@paulfree14 @status

we do not actually know jester's instance blocklist, unless this information has been recently published.

a bad take on what IP ranges he accepts users from is not nationalism, it is simply a bad take based on a complete and fundamental misunderstanding of how counterintelligence ops work on social media.

intelligence agencies use VPN and proxy services, making his entire strategy for preventing intelligence ops pointless, and he is naive about the west not doing it's own intelligence ops, of course.

but none of this is nationalist on it's own, and i'm not willing to throw that type of accusation around without having evidence.

in the immortal words of Jesus Quintana, "you might fool the fucks in the league office, but you don't
fool Jesus."

@status @kaniini

lol. the only person that seems to be naiv is you.
jester is known for being a patriot hacker. They know what they are doing here.

They are blocking others based on in which nation they are.

@paulfree14 @status

i am well aware of what he has posted on his site.

i have also described why what he has posted will fail, according to his rationale.

thank you for implying that i am an idiot, though.

@status @paulfree14

by the way, in case you didn't notice, posting a screenshot is not evidence that he intends to be nationalist, and even if that is the case, that's not the reason why an instance should be blocked.

an instance should be blocked if it's users are harassing people and the admin doesn't care about it, or if there is reason to believe (backed with evidence) that this will be the case in the future.

otherwise you are just punishing people who got sucked into his instance for no reason other than that you dislike the owner and/or his bad take.

@paulfree14 @status

in other words, an instance block should be considered a nuclear option, and used only with extreme prejudice.

where my position is that admins should take care with regard to blocking their own/remote users, it is even more stronger when it comes to blocking entire instances.

reading an about page and getting pissed off because you don't agree with it, without it otherwise being an actual problem, is no reason to just start playing ban-hammer.

@status @paulfree14

and to be clear, i'm not a fan of the guy, but i don't see that as a reason to punish 9000+ users.

consider strongly that these people probably just signed up through his advertising and aren't really super aware of other instances yet. that is a problem with rapid growth.

counter.social is nationalist 

@status @kaniini

NATIONALISM IS THE PROBLEM.

They enforce rules national wide.
They enforce rules based where one comes from.

What's that if not nationalism

counter.social is nationalist 

@paulfree14 @status

I block Nigeria from my mail server, because I don't like 419 scams. Is my mail server nationalist?

counter.social is nationalist 

@status @kaniini
do you advertize your mailserver with something like
'we are blocking hostile nations that try to weaponize our communication'?

counter.social is nationalist 

@paulfree14 @status

I do not, I just don't wish to receive emails telling me I won the 'e-mail lottery' and to send my personal information to some person in Nigeria to get my money.

With that said...

Russian intelligence is trying to weaponize social media, this is *very well documented.*

They have done it in the US, they have done it in Europe, and they did significant astroturfing in regards to brexit, boosting with fake news and fake social media interactions, for the leave campaign. It is even possible that brexit happened because of this russian intelligence influence.

This is actually a real problem, because they *are* undermining democracies in the west with this fake crap they are pushing.

With *that* said... it is likely that the US and other western countries are doing the same thing against them.

So I do believe his intention is what he says it is: he is concerned about the manipulation intelligence agencies are doing on social media. Like I have said many times, it's just the strategy that is entirely tone-deaf and misinformed.

counter.social is nationalist 

@status @kaniini

ok then don't get your mind blown with what I'm sayn now:

moderation + no social algorytm + no pay to get more views

Everthing jester described, why they are blocking IP's comming from 'hostile nations' can be solved with the way mastodon is designed.
...meanwhile the IP blocks don't work at all to stop fakenews, bots etc to spread around.

Also don't forget that he's connected with the army.

counter.social is nationalist 

@paulfree14 @status

> ok then don't get your mind blown with what I'm sayn now:

ok, will do!

> moderation + no social algorytm + no pay to get more views

indeed, but paying to get more views is only part of what they were doing.

> Everthing jester described, why they are blocking IP's comming from 'hostile nations' can be solved with the way mastodon is designed.

yes, it absolutely can! and that's the point that should be driven home to jester!

> ...meanwhile the IP blocks don't work at all to stop fakenews, bots etc to spread around.

you're absolutely right! i covered that already: they use proxies & VPNs, making the GeoIP blocking ineffective.

> Also don't forget that he's connected with the army.

what does this have to do with anything? i know plenty of people who have served in various militaries, and they are good people with good leftist values. i'm not saying jester is a leftist, of course he is not, my point is just that military service does not make you evil.

counter.social is nationalist 

@status @kaniini
war is created through creating enemies in the first place. That's what they do. They mark a nation as an enemy. ppl in the army are those who go to fight in war.
Jester played in the war against terrorism, and what I know also attacked Assange and Snowden, to stop leaking or to get arrested. (I'm not 100% shure about that)

But that's a bit offtopic.

fb is an american company, not a russian one.

counter.social is nationalist 

@status @kaniini
- nothing what jester claimed to solve with nation block works

- jester is known as a hacker

- means they knows that what they that is bullshit

- jester is agressivly aderticing this on twitter, without one time mentioning mastodon

This is a pure propaganda battle.

The jester: a lesson in asymetric warfare

counter.social is nationalist 

@paulfree14 @status

many people who don't know any better refer to many script kiddies as "hackers."

there's never been any evidence that jester has written any of his own exploits, instead he just ddoses things.

counter.social is nationalist 

@kaniini @paulfree14 @status Just here to mention that jester does meet a number of signs for fascism, not all of them but enough to be concerning mastodon.starrevolution.org/me

counter.social is nationalist 

@status @paulfree14 @kaniini Hes pro-military/police. Pro capitalism/anti-communist and pro toxic masculinity as well as pro aggressive foreign policy. And he is indeed quite nationalist in his defense of the american government.

counter.social is nationalist 

@kaniini @paulfree14 @status The features he lacks are pro racism/xenophobia. At least overtly to my knowledge. He may not even be aware he is leaning toward fascism

Show newer
Show newer

counter.social is nationalist 

@Laurelai @paulfree14 @status

yes, that's my point.

there are legitimate reasons to ban his instance.

the bad take on his about page is not the reason to do it, and removes transparency.

counter.social is nationalist 

@kaniini @paulfree14 @status Well his tendency to libel people was enough for me to block his instance.

Show newer
Show newer

counter.social is nationalist 

@paulfree14 @status

They (pointlessly) enforce rules based on what some dubious at best GeoIP database says about the IP you're connecting from.

The way you put it, they are blocking Russians who live in the US, and short of leveraging CLD3 (which their patch does not do), that's likely to be technically impossible.

For the last time, there's plenty of legitimate reasons to block counter.social, but the pointless GeoIP banning isn't really one of them.

counter.social is nationalist 

@status @kaniini
they say on their webpage:

''We ...block... IP space originating in Russia, China, North Korea, Iran, Pakistan and Syria.''

''Counter.Social is the first Social Network Platform to take a zero-tolerance approach to hostile nations... weaponizing OUR social media..''

That's what they write. And that is nationalism.

counter.social is nationalist 

@paulfree14 @status

And again, it is a misinformed response to the *very well documented* weaponization attempts Russian intelligence has done on facebook.

In case you didn't know: all of those countries are allied with Russia.

I didn't say this was a good strategy for combating this problem, or that Russia is the only player in that space, it's just the one *everyone is talking about.*

counter.social is nationalist 

@status @kaniini
It is documented that *every* intelligence service is doing so.

The point is, fb and mastodon are completly different designed. Jester describes a problem that is just fantasy for mastodon, and claims he's solving the issue of 'hostile nations' not weaponizing our communication.

But that's simply not true. It's the way mastodon is desinged that stops it.

counter.social is nationalist 

@paulfree14 @status

yes, I agree there.

my point is that he shouldn't be banned based on that fantasy, when there are so many better reasons to ban him, which could be found with 5 minutes of research.

Sign in to participate in the conversation
Mastodon

The social network of the future: No ads, no corporate surveillance, ethical design, and decentralization! Own your data with Mastodon!